OLTP Vs Decision Support
Mar 2, 2004
Whilst on the Nth hour (n = many) of my magical journey through MS Sql BOL I've come across OLTP Vs Decision Support. After a couple of searches here could someone shore up the following for me please...
A decision support database is the same as warehouse database.
This is for static data commonly used for reporting and analysis.
OLTP is a live database (accomodates inserts, deletes, updates etc).
Is that right?
Also would it be fair to assume that a decision support database is generally going to be spawned from the historical data of an OLTP database? Any real world examples of these two terms would be greatly appreciated too.
Cheers
Dan
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Dec 5, 2005
Reader Community
I've just started hosting my newly created Microsoft Visual Web Developer 2005 Express Edition web site. Unfortunately the Login group membership functions will not function correctly. Having contacted the web service hosting provider, They replied: "We do not support SQL express2005. The only way to use the extra functions of ASP.NET2 such as group membership is if it is using an SQL 2000 database to connect to. "
Is it possible to design web sites with Microsoft Visual Web Developer 2005 Express Edition that store membership details on an SQL 2000 database?
I've just paid £88 approx. $140 for a years subscription, have I chosen the wrong web service hosting provider?
Should I have designed the web site with a better web site design software tool that also makes designing membership login functionality easy, just as Microsoft Visual Web developer 2005 express edition?
Look forward to all comments?
Regards
Philip
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Aug 1, 1998
Is it possible / advisable to use Sql Server as the backend database for handling 40 million transactions,
taking around 8 GB space?
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Dec 19, 2007
hello everyone,
Is it make sense to create 2 databases, OLTP for the insert, update and delete and OLAP for selection
and i'll sync between the 2 databases.
Thanks
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Aug 28, 2007
hi. i dont understand what they mean when they say developing oltp solutions. can anybody pls explain it to me. also does anyone know what ways there are to develop sql oltp solutions using SQL 2005 reporting services, OLTO, Excel Services. as well as any good tutorials for it?
thanks for the help.
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Jul 23, 2005
Greetings All, I was wondering if any of you would share some of yourexperiences regarding the task of loading a data store from an Oltpsource. We are using Analysis Services in a BI product that requiresdata to be pulled from one of our products, an OLTP database. Thedesign is to first run an ETL process from the OLTP source into anoperational data store, from here Analysis Services will pull its datato do its thing. Now, for small OLTP databases (< 1Gb) the storedprocs I have written to do the extraction works well, it is relativelyfast and efficient. However, we have a few databases that are 10Gb'sand the load could end up taking several hours. During this long loadthe OLTP source may be in use and I want to avoid write blocks, or if Iwere to use "select ... NOLOCK" I could get dirty data brought over. Icould used BCP for some of the big tables or Bulk Copy but I wanted tosee if anyone has dealt with this issue and what their specificresolution was for their specific problem. It is my hope that byseeing how others have dealt with this I will be able to architect asolution for my specific problemRegards, TFD.
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Mar 7, 2008
I want to know the basic dfferences between these 2 (OLTP and OLAP) ?
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Jan 12, 2006
we are using an object database for our OLTP but for reporting we have
got some issues about performance as the cpu becames a bottleneck.And
we want to be able to run on low end computers...
One of our team members suggested to replicate the object database to a
SQL table.But just a single one.The most denormalized thing ever.(358 coloumns)
is this the fastest way we can get in reporting?
*we don't want harddisk,ram or cpu to became a bottleneck. ( must run on cheap staff)
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Oct 15, 2007
Interested in feedback from the SQL grand wizards (and would-be wizards) that haunt these forums.
Let's say you need to constantly stream data into an OLTP system. We are talking multiple level hierarchies totaling upwards of 300 MB a day spread out not unlike a typical human sleep cycle (lower data during off-peak, still 24/7 requirements). All data originates from virtual machines running proprietary algorithms. The VM/data capture infrastructure needs to be massively scalable, meaning that incoming data is going to become more and more frequent and involve many different flat record formats.
The data has tremendous value when viewed both historically as well as in real-time (95% of real-time access will be read-only). The database infrastructure is in it's infancy now and I'm trying to develop a growth plan that can meet the needs of the business as the data requirements grow. I have no doubt that the system will need to work with multiple terabytes of data within a year.
Current database environment is a single server composed of a Dell PowerEdge 2950 (Intel Quad Core 5355, 16 GB RAM, 2 x 73 GB 15K RPM SAS ) with an attached Dell PowerVault MD1000 (15 x 300 GB 10K RPM SAS in RAID 5+0 [2x7] w/hot spare) running Win 2k3 64-bit and SQL Server 2005 x64 Standard, 1-CPU.
I am interested in answering the following questions:
Based on the scaling requirements of the data capture and subsequent ETL, what transmission method would you find most favorable? For instance, we are weighing direct database writes via stored procedures for all VM systems versus establishing processes to collect, aggregate and stream CSVs into a specialized ETL environment running SSIS packages that load data and then call SQL Stored procedures to scrub and prepare for production import. The data will require scrub routines that need access to current production data, so distributing the core data structures to multiple ETL processing systems would be expensive and undesireable.
Cost is very important to the overall solution design. In terms of database infrastructure, how would you maximize business value while keeping cost as low as possible? For instance, do you think there is more value in an ACTIVE/ACTIVE cluster (2 x CPU licenses) where one system acts as ETL and the other as OLTP or would you favor replication of production data from ETL to OLTP or (vice-versa). With the second scenario, am I mistaken in thinking we could get away with a Server/CAL licensing model for the ETL server?.
Are there any third party tools that I should research that would greatly aid me here?
I appreciate all feedback, criticism, and thoughts.
Best Regards,
Shane
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May 21, 2008
Hi al,
I need some steps to create OLAP DB .
Actually i have OLTP Db . i created SSAS soln and created cube with necessary dimensions . i deployed it on SSAS instance of management studio.
my qn, is the instance created under SSAS instance OLAP?.
pls provide me steps to have a OLAP database...
Thanks,
Nav
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Nov 3, 2015
Simple and conventional OLTP database, we need to capture all changes for insert into a DW via staging / ods etc.
Is there a recommended approach for this? Obviously it has to be real time as there might be multiple updates for a time period. I'm thinking of triggers on OLTP tables (bad for performance as it's synchronous), or change data capture, service broker as asynchronous methods.
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Apr 22, 2008
I was wondering if it is possible to use SQL Server Reporting Services 2005 with the 'writeback' feature to the source OLTP database?
I have seen article's that refer to using SQL Server Analyses Services (SSAS) and writing back to the ROLAP/MOLAP database, however this is not desirable for our case.
I have almost come to the conclusion that it is not possible without SSAS.
Cheers,
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Jul 14, 2015
How many no of records of the tables are called large tables.
We are getting more deadlocks. We are using default isolation. Read & insert statements are blocking each other and causes dead locks.
I am thinking that might be purging will reduce deadlocks.
The table has 15million records. Is this table consider as large table or not in OLTP systems?
In general how many records we need to consider as large table.
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Nov 4, 2015
I have been looking at implementing a tabular model based on an OLTP database that's not dimensional. I know that this is possible but during my proof of concept I have encountered numerous problems ...
The things that I have run into are: After setting up the relationships I have found that measures filter context don't propagate along the relationships as I would expect. if the measure is coming from a target table and not a source then an ALL member is returned ( as in multi dimensional when a dimension isn't related to a measure group). Given the lay out of an OLTP database this will be hard to avoid.
One thing I have done to try an mitigate the above problem is to combine the tables used for measures in a view and using that in the source to connect to the rest of the tables. however due to the tables being of different grains this has then created duplication in some of the keys and measures. so the keys cant be used in relationships and the measures aren't accurate.
Are these things other people have come across? or should I give up the ghost and just recommend using dimensional models for the source? is tabular just geared towards a DW the same as multidimensional?
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Mar 12, 2007
I want to create a mirrored DB set for data entry in a extremely busy OLTP DB. I want to add transactional replication between the production server and a staging server outside my quorum that I will use to index the data and prepare it for reporting and warehousing purposes.
If/when fail-over takes place, what happens to my transactional replication between the former production sever (now presumably offline) and my staging DB? Does it switch to the new production server automatically or do I have to manually set the replication between the new production server and the staging DB?
Thanks in advance.
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Aug 14, 2007
We have a live OLTP database for which we create full backups every week and differential backups every day. Recently we added an OLAP database, which we need to update daily with changes from the live database.
This is the process we are planning to use.
1. Restore last full OLTP backup.
2. Apply the last differential OLTP backup.
At this point we should have a replica of the live OLTP database.
3. Update OLAP database based on the OLTP replica database.
4. Delete the OLTP replica database.
Two questions.
1. If different from the process above, how is this OLTP-to-OLAP transformation typically done in the industry?
2. What is the best way to implement this process with SQL Server 2005?
Thanks.
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Jul 9, 2015
Question: Is it feasible to use a star schema dimensional model for an OLTP system that incurs few (750 per day)Sales Orders transactions?
Background: My customer wants to replace an existing OLTP system database because it runs on Oracle and their in-house expertise is in SQL Server. The original database developers that designed the Oracle DB have apparently retired. The Oracle database has been over-normalized, to say the least. The number of sales orders being entered daily is small: about 500-750 per day. These entries are done at the five clerks' convenience, from a paper form, and are very unlikely to ever be entered in quick succession. Nothing else gets regularly entered into this database except for the occasional change to a customer, but new customers are very few and far between.
I've designed a star schema for the replacement database with the Sales Order Header and Sales Order detail table combined into a single 'fact' table, and I've introduced some duplication into dimension tables (like customer) in order to eliminate some of the joins (and confusion) that were built into the original database.
I've never tried this before. Is there any reason this would not or should not work?
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Aug 9, 2007
Hello,friends
1) CustomerID
2) FirstName
3) MiddleName
4) SurName
5) Title
6) Marital Status
7) Education
8) Occupation
9) Annual Income
10) Line of Business
11) DOB
12) Father Name
13) Mother Name
14) SpouseName
15) Gender
16) Email
17) MainTel
18) Home Tel
19) Passport Number
20)----------------------
21)- - - - - - - - - - -
100)-------------------
Above mentioned list is a snapshot of our customer master table ,which contain approximately 100 attributes related to a customer.
We are designing an application for banking sector (but NOT Core banking solution),for which we may need to capture variable number of addresses for bank's customer,i.e more then three types of addresses Fixed,Temporary and Communication addresses(which is generally the case with all banks).
A single address includes address1/address2/city/country/state/pincode fields.
In context of OLTP database,We have option to put multiple addresses in child table but that involves various joins at the time of data retrival and slow down the query.
As another option we can can create redundent addresses columns(address1/address2/city/country/state/pincode) in master table that will accumulate addresses if demand for more then three type addresses arises(although there is reasonable numer of extra addresses is expected, i.e 10)
Database is expected to serve the records of 25 million(approx) bank's customer,so does someone can suggest me how to maintan the balance between two approches.
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Jun 17, 2015
We had one of the major issues where one of the table on a heavily used OLTP database seems to have updated the records which were not expected.
Scenario:
We got around more than 12K contracts updated to status expired even though the expiry date is not set to be so:
for E.G : Below table has a column contract status which overnight seems to have updated the values to expired.
Even though the start and expiry date does not follow the logic for above.
We had the above working for past 3 years via a SP scheduled via SQL agent Job which Expire active contracts whose expiration date is less than today's 12:00AM.There has been no change in SP.
How can i track how it happened and what caused it?
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Nov 10, 2015
1. I need to make use of in memory engine for my pr-existed develop procedures ,tables ,index. do I need and code changes for application and how to store tables /indexes in OLTP memory
Assume table index may have primary key index as well.
2. If table with one primary index and 2 foreign constraints, 3 non clusters indexed. which one able o load to memory area and how t do that.
3. In memory is lock free zone. usually locks will happpen in RDMS context . how this works without locks.
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Dec 10, 2007
Hello everyone
I'm designing a new database for a project. In this database I have a calendar table with with the following columns:
id, dateValue, year, quarter, week, month, englishMonthName, day, englishDayName, dayOfTheYear, isWeekendDay
This database also has a session monitor that logs every access to the database, with a relation to the calendar row id. This way, I can make database access reports, without replicating the date value.
My question is: for a membership table should I follow the same principle and relate member row to the session monitor, which in turn, relates to the calendar or should I put the date just there?
Some of the tables of this database will have to handle some heavy load, both for updating and selecting. This said, my question is should I make a link or put the date just there to extinguish the need to make 2 joins just to know when something was registered / updated? If I only place the relation to know the date I'll have to do something like:
SELECT
DATEADD(ss, x.timeOffsetInSeconds, c.dateValue) AS date
FROM
<somewhere> x
JOIN sessionMonitor sm ON sm.id = x.sessionMonitorId
JOIN calendar c ON c.id = sm.calendarId
Instead of just doing a select x.lastUpdateDate
How would you gurus usually deal with these situations?
Best regards
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Jan 17, 2008
I've decided to put the clustered index on the edit date column on an audit table. As the edit date for a new record is always going to be higher (more recent) than the previous record, the value would go onto the end of the index. So is there still a value in (1) providing a fill specification of less than 100% and (2) padding the index?
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Nov 6, 2006
I am studying the behavior of 200.000 clients. With the use of decision trees I would like to know if my clients will abandon our service or not. I use a training set of 21.822 clients and I use a predict variable "aband" wich is a discrete variable and it can be 0 or 1. In my training set i have 21.597 cases in which aband is 0 and 255 cases in which aband is 1. Looking at the classification matrix obtained using as input table a testing set (unselected data) I can see that my decision tree doesn't recognize the cases in which aband is 1. Here is the Classification Matrix:
Counts for Dati Training on [Aband]
Predicted 0 (Actual) 1 (Actual)
0 21597 225
1 0 0
What should I do?
Chiara
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Apr 16, 2007
I'm having this problem.....
I wanted to use the Decision Tree to show a result..... after i configure the Mining Structures..... and set all the input.... my decision tree shows only until level 2..... i have 3 input and one PredictOnly column.....where is the other input?
Say.... i have House Owner, Marital Status, Num Cars Owned and Number Of Children(PredictOnly)
my Tree only shows All ---- > Marital Status when i input all 3 together...... the other 2 doesn't seems to show.
wat should i do?? my database in SQL Server and the other keys are all correct and deploying finely.....why is this happening.....?
i'm a newbie in this software.......so any pro here can plz help me if there's actually something that i might have missed out along the way.......
Thank you again.........
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May 18, 2006
I would appreciate answers to the following doubts I have regarding Decision trees, CONTAINS and using CONTAINS in a DMX query:
1. Does MS decision tree work only off equality/inequality conditions for the nodes? Is it possible to use a predicate as the branch criteria for a node?
2. Can the T-SQL predicate CONTAINS(...) be used in a DMX query? I need to check if a column-value is a substring of another column and create an intermediate column that will enable me to construct a decision tree with the phrase-present/absent branch.
3. Can CONTAINS(...) be used in a select clause? Like -
SELECT CONTAINS(JAT.column1, '"Good day"')
FROM JustAnotherTable;
4. Does CONTAINS(...) support both arguments to be column references? Or, is it mandatory that the pattern (argument #2) has to be a literal string or a variable? E.g.: I need to know the validity of the following expression -
SELECT * FROM JustAnotherTable JAT
WHERE CONTAINS(JAT.column1, JAT.column3);
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Jul 3, 2007
Hello,Can I import an OLTP (Reltional DB) as a Data Source into SQL ServerAnalysis Services 2005 and then use the Cube Wizard and the new DataSource View feature to create the OLAP model ?Or do I have to first design an OLAP Data Warehouse with a Star Schemaand then import this DW as a Data Source into my Analysis ServicesProject.With SQL Server 2000 , OLAP would be the way to go..but with SQLServer 2005 , it seems as though the wizard and data source viewfeatures do half the work for you.I have an OLTP DB and am not sure which route I should take ! Anysuggestions / input would be much appreciated.Thanks in Advance...RegardsRusszee
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Nov 24, 2014
How to write Stored Procedures to load the Data Model from OLTP to DWH ?
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Nov 13, 2001
Playing with DTS for converting text data to SQL Server table and sending email messages. Package is to be scheduled hourly.
1. Is there any easy way to force DTS to choose Success or Failure based on a SQL Task? Wish to check contents of a table for new values and branch accordingly in DTS.
2. When new records are brought in I wish to build a custom email message rather than attaching a text file. Any Idea how to build a custom message?
I am attempting to auto scan an error log on a Unix based system and email myself when errors occur. This is an exercise to test scheduling of jobs, bridging between technologies and sending out meaningful messages based on the process via email.
Thanks,
Mike Hoyt
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Aug 3, 2007
Hi,
I'm new to data mining, and have created an MS decision trees model. The model has the columns age, call outcome, call reason, country name, employee name and gender - all as inputs.
In the mining model viewer, I only get nodes for the age, despite having data for all the other columns.
Can anyone help?
Thanks
Jeremy
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Jun 28, 2007
Hi,
Can we represent the Decision Tree in a programatically way in an .NET application? I understand that the outcome of a Decision Tree model can be integrated into an .NET application but not sure if we can also visualize it. Does MS SQL Server support any API to render such a tree?
Thanks a lot!
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Oct 20, 2007
I have got a lot of results like the following two nodes:
All
Existing Cases: 1035298
Missing Cases: 1604
Y = 3,214,966,177,062,520,000,000.000
a >= -0.9822378254 and < -0.7867621803
Existing Cases: 45291
Missing Cases: 17
Y = 9,491,528,329,086,450,000,000.000
Every node of the tree is as odd as this. I checked the training data and found there are 5 bad points with extraordinarily high values of Y. There are over a million points, how can these five points screw up the entire analysis.
I do have good results for other predicted parameters even though they also bad points.
Any tip?
Thanks,
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May 2, 2006
I have an example case below :
Customer Id
Debt Level
Income Level
Employment Type
Credit Risk
1
High
High
Self-Employed
Bad
2
High
High
Salaried
Bad
3
High
Low
Salaried
Bad
4
Low
Low
Salaried
Good
5
Low
Low
Self-Emplyed
Bad
6
Low
High
Self-Employed
Good
7
Low
High
Salaried
Good
My question is how to make a tree from the case above I mean what method we should use to split the tree. (Mannually counting)
I hope anyone could help me by explaining i details.Because i want to make some analysis how microsoft decision tree works exactly.So Please explain me the process to build the tree completely with the method.
Thanks a lot.
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Dec 8, 2007
Hi,
I'm interested in understanding how the parametes work in the MS Decision Trees algorithm.
As far as I can tell, the MINIMUM_SUPPORT and COMPLEXITY_PENALTY parameters both control the number of splits and hence the depth of the tree.
Unfortunately the BOL descriptions are very brief - so can anyone tell me the difference between these 2 parameters?
Thanks
Jeremy
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