Transport Security Vs Dialog Security

Aug 3, 2006

In an environment where there are many initaitors speaking to a central target with frowarders in between, from what i can understand this best policy is to disable encryption on the endpoints, since dialog encryption will be enforced this is all that is really required, is this correct.

If the endpoints used encryption the message would need to be encrypted and decrypted at each forwarder resulting in slower perfromance, where as dialog encryption would only encrypt at the sender and decrypt at the target, so is this the best way to go?

Secondly is it best practice to open a dialog initally and send messages over this dialog for years never ending the conversation? This way the services only have to authenticate eachother once, if there are no reboots etc that is of course.

I would think performance wise sending each message and ending the conversation each time is a much greater overhead ? So would it be best practice to keep dialogs open and keep sending messages ?

Initally when i was learning service broker i thought that one must send a message and end the dialog until the next message, but i think the other way is the best option ?

Is this correct ?

Thanx

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Service Broker Dialog And Transport Security

May 25, 2006

what is the difference between the Dialog security and the transport security?

If I disable the dialog security can the messages be sent to the a different SQL server instance. As the transport security will encrypt the messages.

If I don't create a certificate to be used by the transport security can the messages be sent to another SQL server instance?

Can a message be sent to another SQL Server instance without creating a REMOTE Service Binding?

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Dialogue Security Vs Transport Security

Feb 19, 2007

Hi

I'm designing a distributed application where I will have SQL Server 2005 distributed databases replicating data to my central hub which is again a SQL Server 2005 database using SQL Service Broker. Data will be sent from the central hub to the distributed sites and vice versa. I need to authenticate the communication and also secure the communication by encrypting the messages. Which security shall I use? Where do I configure the type of security being used? What is the difference between transport security Vs dialogue security - Full security model?



Thanks

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SQL Service Broker - Transport Security

Feb 20, 2007

If all my SQL Server instances are mutually trusted, am planning to implement transport layer security with Windows authentication. My query is that if I'm using Windows authentication do I need certificates to be created? Though I am using Transport security, I can achieve encryption by ENCRYPTION - ON in the Begin Dialogue conversation. I assume Message integrity using MD5 signatures are by default provided by Service broker irrespective of whichever service options we choose?

Can I have some article references on how these security mechanisms will impact the performace of Service broker communications?



Thanks a lot,

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Dialog Security Questions

Aug 10, 2006

Hi Remus

Thank you for the email reply.

However i am still not 100% clear, dialog security with certificates when there are hundreds of remote services seems a bit complicated.

I have a few more questions.

1. you said "When sending the first message (any direction), we look up the 'best' certificate for each user"

My inititor sevice is owned by dbo, i have created certificates only for named users not dbo, how would this work?

2. I am going to try settin gup this again, but at the central service i will create a seprate user for each remote service, authorize the remote certificate for this user and use this user in the remote service binding for that remote service, is this correct or am i still doing somehting wrong?

3. How does all of this relate to the endpoint security, i ahve the same scenario, 1 pricipal id with all remote certificates authorized for it for the endpoint? I have no idea how i would have to setup different user for each remote servcie as far as the endpoint goes as there is no remote service binding to dictate which user to use ?

I will keep try and experimenting maybe i will get it right sooner or later.

Thank You

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Sep 20, 2005

I am in the process of evaluating the use of Service broker for messaging in a load balanced configuration, and am not having any success.  My configuration is as follows.   1) Master database on Box #1 which is the initiator of all dialogs 2) Target database on Box #2 3) Target database on Box #3   One of my goals is that the databases on Box #2 and #3 are as close to identical as possible.   My routing table on Box #1 looks something like the following   Name remote_service_name broker_instance address TargetOne TargetService
E96DC67E-F696-4D93-8545-C2E92157E32D tcp://server1:4022/ TargetTwo TargetService
56607120-26AA-4AAA-B9E4-F14689C40E41 tcp://server2:4022/   My messaging process begins with a dialog initiated from the master database (Box #1) to each of the target services.  At this time, only the first server "tcp://server1:4022/" is receiving messages.  The sys.transmission_queue shows a message outbound to "tcp://server2:4022/" with a blank status.   I believe that my delivery problem has something to do with the resolution of the dialog certificate need for the conversation.  The MSDN documentation states that:   "Service Broker uses a remote service binding to locate the certificate to use for a new conversation...The certificate for user_name must correspond to the certificate for a user in the database that hosts the remote service."    I am confused as to how I would configure remote service binding if one can not create more than one binding for the same remote_service_name.   The following throws an exception on the last creation of the binding.
---CODE SNIP---
CREATE CERTIFICATE UFEDlgCertTargetPublic

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Confusion About Dialog Security Steps.

Aug 3, 2006

Hi There

I have done the following.

2 Servers across the net work Server A and Server B.

I have created private keys at each and copied to public keys across.

I create an endpoint at each with validation by the certificates. I then create appropriate users and logins at each and import the public certificates with authorization to the users who have send permission on the endpoints.

That is transport security sorted and it works.

Now from what i have learnt from examples, to setup dialog security i do the following.

create a private key in each DB :

create certificate Store001DialogPri

with subject = 'Store001DialogPri',

start_date = '07/20/2006'

active for begin_dialog = on;

go

I then copy the public key to each server, create a user only in each DB and import the public keys with authorization on the user. And grant send to the appropriate servcies to the user.

I then create appropriate remote service bindings with this user.

Now this works for me. Everythign seems A OK.

However i am going thorugh the Service Broker "bible", and there are a ton of steps i am not doing but my setup works ???

Steps i am not doing for example is when i create the private keys in the DB i should authorize them to a user i create who is then gratnted CONTROL permission on the SERVICES.

Now i do not do this but everything seems to be working. I thought i finally understood dialogs security but now i am totally confused ?

Is what i am doing correct ? If so why are these all these additinal steps mentioned ? WHat am i missing ?

Thanx

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Dialog Security And Message Encryption

Apr 25, 2006

I understand that Dialog Security + certificates can be used to encryption individual dialogs. I have several demos working now that do just this.However, I don't fully understand exactly when the messages are encrypted, and if they are ever written to a queue on the initiating service prior to being encrypted. I want to make sure that admins can't simply query the transmission queues to get clear text messages, because I have strict requirements that I encrypt all personal data that is stored anywhere in a database.
BOL is a little unclear on this topic. The relevant doc reads:For a dialog that uses security, Service Broker encrypts all
messages sent outside a SQL Server instance. Messages that remain within a SQL
Server instance are never encrypted. In dialog security, only the database that
hosts the initiating service and the database that hosts the target service need
to have access to the certificates used for security. That is, an instance that
performs message forwarding is not required to have the capability to decrypt
the messages that the instance forwards.Does this imply that message destined for an external service aren't encrypted until they leave the instance? Or does Service Broker figure out that the message is destined for a remote service and therefore applies encryption to the message_body prior to the message hitting the transmission queue on the initiating service?Many thanks, Kevin

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www.codeplex.com/slm

Setting up Service Broker routes, endpoints and security is just too hard. One has to run pages and pages of Transact-SQL code just to get the €˜Hello, world€™ example work between two separate SQL Instances and the chances of making a mistake are overwhelming.
Well, not anymore! I€™ve just uploaded into the Service Broker team code gallery a new GUI tool for doing just that: easily configure two services to be able to have conversations. The tool uses the €˜Service Listing€™ concept. A Service Listing is like an identity card for a service. It is an XML document that contains all the necessary information needed to establish a conversation with that service. When two parties need to establish a conversation, they can exchange the Service Listings of the two services and the tool will create the entire infrastructure needed to establish the conversation. Optionally it can also create the message types and contracts supported by a target service in the initiator service database....

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In Service Broker Message Dialog Security Is Not Available For This Conversation...

Jul 23, 2007

when ever I send my message thru Service Broker I am getting an error message like this "



"Dialog security is not available for this conversation because there is no remote service binding for the target service. Create a remote service binding, or specify ENCRYPTION = OFF in the BEGIN DIALOG statement."



This I found in sys.transmission_queue

Please reply with your comments

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May 31, 2007

Hi Remus,



I am experiencing the same problem, and I can't get the easy fix to work. I drop and create the DB's in between tests, so it is not related to having an old certificate in the DB, as in the case of Tilfried.



The situation is as follows:

DB1 owned by login1, has a user for login2; this DB is for the initiator

DB2 owned by login2, has a user for login1; this DB hosts the target

Both DB's have TRUSTWORTHY flag set to ON

Error in sys.transmission_queue: 'Error 916, State 3: The server principal "Login1" is not able to access the database "DB2" under the current security context.



Going on a limp, I decide to add a remote service binding in DB1, binding the user for Login2 to the target service, even though BOL explicitly states that this is only required for cross-server communications. This does change the situation - I still get an error, but a new message is sys.transmission_queue: "Dialog security is unavailable for this covnersation because there is no certificate bound to the database principal (Id: 5). Either create a certificate for the principal, or specify ENCRYPTION = OFF when beginning the conversation." I already know that the first option works, but I wanted to get the simple solution running. As for the second option, I doublechecked and the initiating procedure DOES already specify ENCRYPTION = OFF in the BEGIN DIALOG CONVERSATION command. My theory is that the remote service binding somehow forces SB to use encryption, but (a) that is not stated in the error message, and (b) if so, then how to get the messages sent over to the target service without using the binding?



==> EDIT: Just saw that you confirmed this theory in your last reply to Tlifried. So I am indeed back to having to find out how to get this to work without remote service binding - it should be possible, but how???



BTW, SELECT @@VERSION shows that I'm on build 3054, in case it matters.



Between all the errors in BOL and less than helpfull error messages produced by SB, I feel like I'm slowly losing my sanity. Please help!



Best regards,



Hugo Kornelis

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Hi,


I have posted this issue for a week, haven't got any reply yet, I posted it again and desperately need your help.


The article http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms365343.aspx says:
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The article also says:

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Your help is highly appreciated!

Desperate developer

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